Sunday, March 14, 2010

Group Gerty Discussion Posts

Post here, Group Gerty!

30 comments:

  1. do you think that if Grante honestly thought he could help Jefferson that maybe Jefferson will react differently?

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  2. what do you guys think it would take for Jefferson to stop referring to himself as hog, is it something Grant can do or is it something only Jefferson can do?

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  3. I believe that it will take much time for Jefferson to realize that he is a man, and not a hog. So far in the book, it seems like there hasn't been much progress made with Jefferson changing his thoughts about himself. I think that in order for Jefferson to stop believing he is an animal, Jefferson must do it himself. As said in page 123, "What for, Tante Lou? He treated me the same way he treated her. He wants me to feel guilty, just as he wants her to feel guilty. Well, I'm not feeling guilty, Tante Lou. I didn't put him there. I d everything I know how to do to keep people like him from going there. He's not going to make me feel guilty." This quote shows how Grant is losing even more faith than he did at first to help Jefferson. Jefferson's only hope is to look to God and realize that he isn't a "hog".

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  4. NOTE TO RESPONDERS: IF YOU DO NOT CITE PAGE NUMBERS OR PROVIDE SPECIFIC DETAILS FROM THE READING, YOU ARE NOT DOING YOUR JOB. YOUR GRADE FOR THESE ENTRIES WILL REFLECT YOUR FAILURE TO FOLLOW DIRECTIONS.

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  5. i believe that Jefferson will stop referring to him self as a hog when he realizes that it doesn't matter what he calls himself. Jefferson is on to repeating lines every so often and then goes back to them during another visit.
    122- "corn for a hog," he said and again "this hog know. fattening up for christmas. kill him at christmastime," he said. he mentioned the food he's not going to eat, calling himself a hog (the equivalent of a little kid playing with there food) and dieing at christmas like the cross.

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  6. grant is not visiting him for any other reason exept that he knows its the right thing to do, even though he's not going out and telling jefferson cause he might want jefferson to think that he doesnt want to be visiting him, like jefferson doesnt want to be in jail then die. it hasn't hit grant on what he really wants jefferson to believe. Grant might not think that becoming a man is what he must do, or if figuring out what the course of jeffersons life ment to him. on page 129 jefferson and grant say "" i never asked to be born," "neither did i." i said "but here i am. and i'm trying to make the best of it." "like coming here vexing me?"" vexing is to harass like a lawyer would do to get the truth out of a person. grant might be harassing Jefferson to see what he really wants.

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  7. Hey guys here are the questions..

    1. What does it say about how the town is feeling about Jefferson and how does it compare to how Grant feels about him?


    2.what is it contradictory about when they set the execution for and who is setting the execution?

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  8. to sum up what everyone has said i think we all agree that Jefferson needs time in order to stop reffering himself as a hog and as patrice said Grant is only there in order to "do the right thing" chris also mentions that for everytime that Grant goes and visits Jefferson he looses more and more faith that he could help jefferson and we can all agree that he never really had faitht to begin with. i also think that we all agree that Jefferson will need to put effort in making himself die as a man it cant be a hundred percent effort from only Grant.

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  9. 1. i think that the town still sees Jefferson in the same light they always have the whites in the town see him as a murder who needs to die and the blacks still see him as that poor young boy who got himself in a lot of trouble. Its clear that none of the whites feel at all bad for Jefferson, blacks were already treated with hostility and now even worse that they believe Jefferson murdered a white man this is proved by the hostility Grant gets when he buys a new radio for Jefferson being that the clerk at the store wouldnt even sell Grant the nice radio (pages 175-176)its clear that there is still much hostility. ALthought the town has lost faith in Jefferson it seams Grant is getting more faith he is realizing that his visits with Jefferson are getting better and that Jefferson is talking more even if its just asking for vanilla ice cream he is comunicating and he also agreed to write down his feelings so dispite what the town might think Jefferson is making progess and Grant sees it.

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  10. 2. its contradicory that the men setting the date for Jeffersons exuction are also the white mean that acussed him of the crime to being with and the fact that they are worried about when it is set as to not disturb festivitys proves that they dont really care that ultametly they are killing an innocent man and that many people are struggling with this soon lost. the exicution is after Easter but before lent which is irnoic cause there celibrations and there more worried about not "ruining" them rather than the fact a man is dieing and they seem to call it justice and the right thing to do

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  11. Like Gabby said, it is contradictory how they originally planned to execute Jefferson two weeks before Ash Wednesday; but, being a very Catholic community, it was forced to be re scheduled to Friday, April 8th, as said in pages 156-157. It is ironic that Jefferson's execution is on Friday, April 8th because Ash Wednesday occurs every year and starts the beginning of Lent for 46 days at a time and the date changes every year sometime in late February or early March. This could mean that April 8th may have been the end of Lent, thus ending Jefferson's life. It also is on a Friday, which is the last day of the week.

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  12. 1) Like Gabby and Chris said they are setting a date on the towns religious day and not the death of a person. page 158 lines 1-4. and then 5 and 6 say because it was the "convenient date and time." and if you mean grant feeling about him, Jefferson i don't think grant thinks it fair that they have so little time to show Jefferson whats important in life.

    2) Guidry is the one who announces on page 156 "it happens second Friday after Easter." with the white men who i guess agreed on it. It being contradictory is that their religion is giving them the in inability to kill him even though no matter what he's going to be killed at some point. Friday or any other day they pick it for no reason its just the day that is most convenient for the people who they think are going to be upset. which most likely they don't even care that much about Jefferson's situation and might just think he's a murderer and deserves to give up his life for someone that he didn't even kill.

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  13. 1) Do you think their is more to why the woman in Grants Life don't like Vivian?

    2) Do you think that by Grant buying Jefferson, the radio, ice cream, candy is getting Reverend Ambrose mad or is it just that he cant get Jefferson to talk to him the the way that Grant does? even thought there not saying that much to each other.

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  14. 1) I believe another reason why Tante Lou, Miss Emma, and the others don't appreciate Vivian's company is because Grant is the only man in the family. And as Grant says in the book, every black man goes through a cycle each generation hoping they will succeed and end up failing. The women in Grant's life don't want Vivian in his life because they feel she will be affecting his work.

    2) Reverend Ambrose is mad at Grant, along with the others, for buying the radio because the believe all of those things essential to helping Jefferson in prison are "sinful", as said many times in Chapter 22. They feel that he is being distracted by the sinning music, causing him to not listen to what they have to say to him. Rev. Ambrose just doesn't realize that Grant has a plan for Jefferson. Like he says in the chapter, the radio is keeping his mind off of the execution, and has made him almost forget about the whole "hog" situation. Reverend Ambrose and the others feel the real way Jefferson should seek for help is by God.

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  15. 1. i agree with Chris that a main reason why its hard for Tante Lou and Miss Emma to accept Vivian or have a hard time when she is because of Grants role in there life Grant is the only male in there life that lives with them and in the times that this book takes place men over power the woman they are suppost to "take care of them" so to speak and if Grant leaves them for another woman or Vivian in this case than they are loosing that protector and that care taker. I also have to agree that the timing of her in his life is rather imposing on what they need at the moment which is for him to compleatly dedicate his time to Jefferson in helping him become a man.

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  16. i think that maybe Reverend Ambrose deep down does feel like he wishes he could get through to Jefferson as Grant is beging to , but at this moment like Chris said he is more focased on how Jefferson becomes a "man" rather than the fact that he is one. Its said in chapter 22 a lot that he feels Jefferson should seek this self aproval through God and not a radio or ice cream or anything else, his views are getting in the way of jefferson truly not feeling like a hog. In chapter 23 Ambrose calls the radio a sinful influence on Jefferson but i think he just wants Jefferson to find GOd and religon his way rather than Grants way.

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  17. i did not make the connection that grant was the only man in the family and that is why the woman acted like that. its good for jefferson to stop thinking of himself as a hog but not saying straight out that grant need to talk jefferson about god is hiding it from him with still talking about life and with out jefferson getting mad at him.

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  18. 1)Do you think that Grant is reaching Jefferson more now that Grant has become more focused on helping him?

    2)Is the relationship between Grant and Jefferson becoming less of just a mandatory thing Grant has to do or has it become a friendship?

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  19. 1. i do think that the reason why Grant is getting more out of Jefferson is because he is starting to become closer and closer and more attached to the issue, if you remenber in the begining of the book Grant didnt care when Jefferson called himself a hog but like we said in class as Grant got angry when visiting Jefferson in the jail cell because he acted like a hog and made it cleaer he didnt think much of himself. Grant yelled and got upset with Jefferson so Grant has to care now his anger proves he cares whether he admits it or not also i think Jefferson is starting to realize that Grant cares so its opening him up a little more than in the begining maybe because he sees Grant believe in him that he should start believing in himself.

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  20. 2. i think that to the to the reader we see Grant really starting to form more of a friendship with Jefferson but in Grants mind i think that thats hard to admit. its clear throughout the book that Grant isnt the one sharing his feelings when he went to visit the sherif to ask for permisson to see jefferson in the beging he didnt really share that he was angry at the way he was being talked to but we could all sense he was, so i do think that he is becoming more friendly with Jefferson although if anyone were to ask him he would make it pretty clear that it is just for miss emma and tante lou but as we see hes getting more and more passionate toards the issus with Jefferson he got angry when the Rev. spoke badly about Jefferson and he got a little upset at the store clerk for not giving him the nice radio to begin with.

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  21. grant is more focused on Jefferson and like gabby said they becoming more focused on each other. i also think it is because Grant doesn't want to be known for failing Jefferson. Grant is telling Jefferson through out chapter 24 that he is no better than any one else but he wants him to try and be a better person. "can you be better because we need you to be and want you to be." 193

    I think that they are becoming friend. even before in another chapter grant tells Jefferson that he is his friend. Grant is taking Jefferson seriously because of the way he cares about him and Jefferson's time in jail.

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  22. Throughout the book, Grant has shown traits of selfishness towards others when others, including Jefferson, are going through rougher times. "I need you to stand with me. He's only got a few more weeks. I need you now more than ever." This shows Grants constant need for people to help him get through troublesome times. Grant needs to grow up and realize he is the only one who is capable of helping Jefferson and that the world doesn't revolve around himself.

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  23. do you thihnk that by jefferson realizing that he has never thought of himself will give him waht he needs to now die with digity or only reinforce his promblems of self worth?

    DO you think anyone could of done what Grant did in order to make Jefferson feel important or that it took a special man to do that?

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  24. 1) I believe that Jefferson realizing that he has never thought of himself will cause him to die as a man and have confidence and walk proudly to the electric chair. As he says in his journal, he talks about how they don't bring hogs to an electric chair.

    2) I believe Grant was special in a way, but I also believe that anyone could have accomplished what Grant has with Jefferson if they put a lot of effort into there work and pushed Jefferson.

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  25. 1) i also think that Jefferson will die with dignity. i also think that before he dies grant will help him understand the world around himself.

    2) i think that only Grant could connect with Jefferson and make progress like he did. i don't think that just anyone could make him write down his feelings in a notebook just so it makes them think about himself. i do believe it can happen completely different people that connect the way that Grant and Jefferson did.

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  26. in summery we agree that Jefferson will now be dying with dignity and that he will die as a man because he sees himself as a man and also we are in argreement that it didnt have to be grant to help jefferson it could of been anyone if they cared and if they pushed jefferson far enough

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  27. why do you think Grant calls his self a slave and says that he is not a teacher?

    Do you think Jefferson wrote anything else in his notebook after chapter 29?

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  28. 1) I believe Grant calls himself a slave because he is obeying his Aunt's orders and the Reverend's. He says he is not a teacher because he truly isn't happy with what he is and wants to escape the town.

    2) I think Jefferson may have wrote other entries in the journal after chapter 29 because when he is being prepared to die, he asks for the journal, which suggests he wrote in it.

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  29. 1. i think that Grant calls himself a clave because he thinks that helping jefferson and doing what everyone tells him to do makes him a slave because slaves do what other people tell them to do and like chris said he probaly doesnt think of himself as a teacher because he doesnt want to be and doesnt have a true disre to be one. he sees it as a job rather that life choice

    2. i also agree that Jefferson wrote more in the notebook after 29 because before he died he must of had a lot of thoughts that he needed to write down and like chris said he asked for it so he probaly wanted to write more in it

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  30. page 214

    here i think that Grant is questioning Rev Amrose because he has gotten to know jefferson and knows that he is a good man so i think its hard for Grant to understand why he is still being punished and questioning if there really is a god out there that is worth praying for if bad things are going to keep happening. Here Grant also shows that he cares about Jefferson though because he says he hopes there is a heaven, so he obviosly wants the best for Jefferson which is showing his connection to him


    page 223

    here Grant is saying that he believes in God but a little bit differently than everyone else because he says god makes love but wont help you in dark times when jefferson asked him if gads going to be waiting for him when he dies grant said he didnt know i think that grant is trying to be as honest as possible with jefferson as he could and i think its huis way of treating jefferson like a man even is its telling jefferson things he doesnt want to hear he is showing that jefferson is a man and that he sees him as one as well

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